View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | View Status | Date Submitted | Last Update |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0007741 | ardour | features | public | 2019-03-20 23:22 | 2022-05-22 17:58 |
| Reporter | colinf | Assigned To | x42 | ||
| Priority | normal | Severity | minor | Reproducibility | always |
| Status | resolved | Resolution | no change required | ||
| Product Version | 5.X git (version in description) | ||||
| Summary | 0007741: Group gain sharing should never happen for groups where it's not enabled | ||||
| Description | If I want a group to have gain sharing (either absolute or relative), I'll enable it in the group's properties. If I don't want a group to have gain sharing by default, I certainly don't want it to have gain sharing when I <Shift>+Click on any of the groups faders. There are more use cases for groups without gain sharing than with it, in my experience, especially now that we have VCAs, which do all that group gain sharing could and more. | ||||
| Additional Information | I have a vague memory of making this report before, but I can't find it now... | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
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This still bothers me. I might have just grouped some tracks to record-enable them together more easily, or even just to make them all the same colour - I really never want gain-sharing for such a group, shift pressed or not. I do find <shift>+click on faders to reset them occasionally useful, but if I accidentally<shift>+click a grouped fader it'll reset all the faders of the group, regardless of what the group is for. Worse, it doesn't even do it consistently: it depends on the setting of the group's 'Relative' gain tick box (which isn't even enabled if 'Gain' is unticked) as to whether the other faders in the group will all reset to 0dB, or keep their gains relative to the 0dB level of the <shift>+clicked fader. Worse still, even if 'Relative' is ticked, faders that would have gone above +6dB are clamped to +6dB, and even the relative balance of the group faders is lost. |
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+1 Would be nice to have the handy shift+click gain reset back affecting just one track, given that Gain is unticked on group settings. |
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I'd add that this happens even with group's side label deactivated, which actually makes me think of it as a bug rather than a feature request. |
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And it's no less inconsistent when a group has 'gain' sharing enabled: in that case, <shift>+click on a grouped fader resets just that fader to 0dB, except if the group itself is disabled, in which case it resets all the faders, relatively or absolutely according to the 'relative' setting. |
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I believe that <shift> was originally supposed to invert the enabled status of a group when clicking on elements of tracks with that group, but even that doesn't seem consistent: some mixer strip controls (e.g. record arm) treat <ctrl > in that way instead. |
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This relates to a bug we've been discussing on the Mixbus forum. Mixbus has a few problems of its own but AFAICT, when the Shift key is being pressed, neither Mixbus nor Ardour take any notice of a group's Gain Sharing status :-( Surely this can't be difficult to fix ? |
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This is intended behavior. Holding down the primary modifier key inverts group behavior: `InverseGroup` (enable disabled groups, disable enabled groups or group-settings) |
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Hi Robin - the problem is that different controls exhibit different behaviours. Mixbus has some additional issues (controls on the Mixer don't always behave like they do in the Editor) but let's just concentrate on Ardour for now... 1) Add 2 tracks to a group and then edit the group to remove the gain control. 2) Each fader behaves (correctly) as though it's not part of the group. And using Shift+ inverts that behaviour (correctly, as we now know...) 3) Now try removing some buttons from the group (let's say the Muting button) 4) Each Mute button now behaves (correctly) as if it's not part of the group - BUT... using Shift+ makes no difference (i.e. it doesn't invert the behaviour) |
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I made a spreadsheet (I know, sorry) enumerating the the <Shift>+click fader behaviour for all the possible states of group enabled/gain sharing/relative to see if it made any more sense seeing it in a table like that. Here it is: is this really all intended behaviour? |
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Incidentally, there's also this comment in gtk2_ardour/gain_meter.cc:586 // XXX hack allow to override group // (this breaks group'ed shift+click reset) I'd argue that breaking <shift>+click reset to 0dB is rather a steep price to pay to allow three different ways to override disabling group gain sharing to exist. |
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Also, it seems perverse to me that a disabled (greyed-out) tick box in the group properties should affect the behaviour of the group. |
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Attached a (trivial) patch to only allow <shift>+click to disable gain sharing if it's enabled in the active group's properties, and not to enable it if it's disabled. I personally think this is better: if the behaviour of enabling gain sharing in a disabled group is also required I really do believe something rather more clever is required than the current code. 0001-gtk2_ardour-only-allow-shift-click-to-disengage-fade.patch (1,219 bytes)
From 94ae6480887b66b604aa0a4b14924e0777828fb0 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: Colin Fletcher <colin.m.fletcher@googlemail.com>
Date: Sun, 22 May 2022 18:55:42 +0100
Subject: [PATCH] gtk2_ardour: only allow shift+click to disengage fader from
group
Don't invert the groups gain sharing setting when the fader is
shift+clicked: only allow shift to disable grouped gain changes when the
group is active.
---
gtk2_ardour/gain_meter.cc | 5 ++---
1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 3 deletions(-)
diff --git a/gtk2_ardour/gain_meter.cc b/gtk2_ardour/gain_meter.cc
index 577b5d4009..22e4469aff 100644
--- a/gtk2_ardour/gain_meter.cc
+++ b/gtk2_ardour/gain_meter.cc
@@ -583,11 +583,10 @@ GainMeterBase::fader_moved ()
value = gain_adjustment.get_value();
}
- // XXX hack allow to override group
- // (this breaks group'ed shift+click reset)
+ // XXX hack allow to override group if active
if (Keyboard::the_keyboard().key_is_down (GDK_Shift_R)
|| Keyboard::the_keyboard().key_is_down (GDK_Shift_L)) {
- _control->set_value (value, Controllable::InverseGroup);
+ _control->set_value (value, Controllable::NoGroup);
} else {
_control->set_value (value, Controllable::UseGroup);
}
--
2.30.2
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| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
|---|---|---|---|
| 2019-03-20 23:22 | colinf | New Issue | |
| 2020-01-22 12:34 | colinf | Note Added: 0020925 | |
| 2020-01-25 13:27 | bluebones | Note Added: 0020930 | |
| 2020-01-25 13:39 | bluebones | Note Added: 0020931 | |
| 2020-01-27 19:30 | colinf | Note Added: 0020937 | |
| 2020-01-27 19:34 | colinf | Note Added: 0020938 | |
| 2022-05-04 12:34 | colinf | Relationship added | related to 0008910 |
| 2022-05-05 09:20 | johne53 | Note Added: 0026433 | |
| 2022-05-20 18:14 | colinf | Relationship added | related to 0007449 |
| 2022-05-21 21:13 | x42 | Assigned To | => x42 |
| 2022-05-21 21:13 | x42 | Status | new => resolved |
| 2022-05-21 21:13 | x42 | Resolution | open => no change required |
| 2022-05-21 21:13 | x42 | Note Added: 0026453 | |
| 2022-05-22 10:46 | johne53 | Note Added: 0026454 | |
| 2022-05-22 13:56 | colinf | Note Added: 0026455 | |
| 2022-05-22 13:56 | colinf | File Added: grouped-fader-shift-click.ods | |
| 2022-05-22 14:01 | colinf | Note Added: 0026456 | |
| 2022-05-22 14:06 | colinf | Note Added: 0026457 | |
| 2022-05-22 17:58 | colinf | Note Added: 0026458 | |
| 2022-05-22 17:58 | colinf | File Added: 0001-gtk2_ardour-only-allow-shift-click-to-disengage-fade.patch |
